Contemporary Christian Music is bad, no question, I gotta play this stuff; my praise band tries to inject some joy and fervor into it. I just think alot of critics dont know about the great artists of Gospel and when they hear this "contemporary" stuff they have the predictable reaction. You get a little defensive. I do the same thing with Classical. Modern classical is mostly terrible but everybody knows Bach etc. But NO secular folk know about Willie Banks
Heres my private reply to Mr Stefan, he admitted he wasnt aware of the artists I mentioned.
"I agree, we joke that the devil couldnt debase Christian music with sex and violence so he made it so BORING to make sure it will never effect secular people"
To secular folk Baptists are indistinguishable from Evangelicals. In fact all Christians who stands up strongly against "progressiveness" are lumped together.
I was explaining the Secular view which I have a vast experience with. Of course there are many factions within each denomination; but not to secular folk. The average Joe cant even explain the difference between Old and New Testament. To these folk Christianity is whatever the Media/Arts/Education Complex tells them it is. If your faction doesnt let gay people in as Pastors you are "Evangelical" by their definition. The term "Born Again" will definitley get you classified as such.
There is no way Jimmy Carter could be Dem nowadays. Bill Clintons faith was very muted
By the way I never got the impression you were from a "liberal" faction. Since I grew up with agnostic parents followed by a career in the music biz; ANY Baptist seems quite conservative. Now Espicopalians and Methodists not so much LOL
It's not a genre I'm that familiar with, but what I've heard I consider much better than Contemporary Christian Music. That said, Protestants from earlier ages had some amazing music. ("Nearer My God To Thee", "Farther Along" and "Go Tell It On The Mountain" are some of my favourites) Not so much today.
There are great mountain hymns with centuries of roots and faith. Many would sound fantastic played by the Byrds. At our Orthodox parish, here in NE Tenn, we play and sing them a lot at wedding receptions, after funerals, during dinner on the grounds. Folk culture is real.
I agree, we joke that the devil couldnt debase Christian music with sex and violence so he made it so BORING to make sure it will never effect secular people
My daughter is a budding Iconographer. She took it upon herself to paint the Icon of the Good Shepherd with Christ carrying a black sheep or at least a black sheep transforming to white. She said Christ came to save sinners and this better represented Jesus love, love not just for the loss of a sheep from the fold, but for the truly lost. One Iconographer said that was truly a unique idea and another said that was not protocol.
Her other thought was in the icon of the Ladder of Divine Ascent, showing Christ reaching down further to aid those stumbling off the ladder. In addition to only demons pulling people off the ladder, she has guardian angels aiding people up the ladder. The idea being that grace abounds.
As an artist, she does not want to merely copy others icons, which she says is important to learn the style and the traditional boundaries. But she struggles, as a creative individual, to remain true to the tradition proclaiming truth while also maintaining enough creativity within the boundaries of Tradition so the art form does not stagnate.
Yes. She has a teacher that has been writing icons for a long time. This teacher liked the idea but didn’t want to risk the black sheep since pitch black represents evil. The other Iconographer is she discussed this with is actually quite famous.
Regarding the Appalachian flair to Byzantine Hymns, well, it is very pleasing to my ears. Enough so that I would consider a move to hear that on a regular basis.
Does Babylon Bee make the cut for comedy/satire entertainment? I’ve always thought of them as the exception to the rule. When people first started linking to their posts, I assumed they were a flash in the pan. But I’ve even had totally secular friends randomly share headlines of theirs just because they thought they were funny.
I appreciate your comments greatly Terry! I don't expect anyone by the way to agree with the entirety of that article. Or with anything I've written.
Looking back, the statements about the Scots-Irish were probably the most underdeveloped aspect of what I wrote and your work of filling in the gaps is valuable. I'm a big fan of numerous Scots-Irish musicians. In addition to what Dr. Vladimir Morosan has written, I know that "Melody" from the Kentucky Harmony shapebook (published in 1816) has also been adapted as an Anaphora/Mercy Of Peace for Orthodox liturgies.
Abraham Kuyper did indeed make some reverential statements about the arts. However...
Jared Wilson from The Gospel Coalition once stated that "the people who are drawn to Reformed Theology, who really resonate with it, tend to be Systematic-type thinkers, those who appreciate order and categories and so on." I return to the issue of aptitude. Different types of aptitude exist, and Systematic aptitude is uncommon among great artists, while being more common among skilled lawyers, accountants, scientists, business owners and military officers. I would posit "wrong type of aptitude" as an explanation for why the Reformed aren't well-represented among the ranks of great classical music composers, for instance.
There are exceptions to trends and rules, and what I say is meant for reasons of brevity, to be more rough and approximate than exact.
Michael Stefan has apparently NEVER listened to Black Gospel Music
Baptists are considered Evanagelicals
Willie Banks, Doc McKenzie, Frank Williams, the list goes on and on
Did you read his whole essay? I points to the strengths of some folk cultures.
Many Baptists call themselves evangelicals and others do not.
Contemporary Christian Music is bad, no question, I gotta play this stuff; my praise band tries to inject some joy and fervor into it. I just think alot of critics dont know about the great artists of Gospel and when they hear this "contemporary" stuff they have the predictable reaction. You get a little defensive. I do the same thing with Classical. Modern classical is mostly terrible but everybody knows Bach etc. But NO secular folk know about Willie Banks
Heres my private reply to Mr Stefan, he admitted he wasnt aware of the artists I mentioned.
"I agree, we joke that the devil couldnt debase Christian music with sex and violence so he made it so BORING to make sure it will never effect secular people"
To secular folk Baptists are indistinguishable from Evangelicals. In fact all Christians who stands up strongly against "progressiveness" are lumped together.
What do you do with proud me and my Bible doctrinally liberal Baptists? Let’s say Bill Clinton?
I was explaining the Secular view which I have a vast experience with. Of course there are many factions within each denomination; but not to secular folk. The average Joe cant even explain the difference between Old and New Testament. To these folk Christianity is whatever the Media/Arts/Education Complex tells them it is. If your faction doesnt let gay people in as Pastors you are "Evangelical" by their definition. The term "Born Again" will definitley get you classified as such.
There is no way Jimmy Carter could be Dem nowadays. Bill Clintons faith was very muted
By the way I never got the impression you were from a "liberal" faction. Since I grew up with agnostic parents followed by a career in the music biz; ANY Baptist seems quite conservative. Now Espicopalians and Methodists not so much LOL
I simply use words based on church history, not public perception. It’s my academic training.
It's not a genre I'm that familiar with, but what I've heard I consider much better than Contemporary Christian Music. That said, Protestants from earlier ages had some amazing music. ("Nearer My God To Thee", "Farther Along" and "Go Tell It On The Mountain" are some of my favourites) Not so much today.
There are great mountain hymns with centuries of roots and faith. Many would sound fantastic played by the Byrds. At our Orthodox parish, here in NE Tenn, we play and sing them a lot at wedding receptions, after funerals, during dinner on the grounds. Folk culture is real.
Oh, and the late Mark Heard was a genius. No way he was ccm. He was the real deal.
https://youtu.be/unz2RugcCCw We trying to change that
I agree, we joke that the devil couldnt debase Christian music with sex and violence so he made it so BORING to make sure it will never effect secular people
My daughter is a budding Iconographer. She took it upon herself to paint the Icon of the Good Shepherd with Christ carrying a black sheep or at least a black sheep transforming to white. She said Christ came to save sinners and this better represented Jesus love, love not just for the loss of a sheep from the fold, but for the truly lost. One Iconographer said that was truly a unique idea and another said that was not protocol.
Her other thought was in the icon of the Ladder of Divine Ascent, showing Christ reaching down further to aid those stumbling off the ladder. In addition to only demons pulling people off the ladder, she has guardian angels aiding people up the ladder. The idea being that grace abounds.
As an artist, she does not want to merely copy others icons, which she says is important to learn the style and the traditional boundaries. But she struggles, as a creative individual, to remain true to the tradition proclaiming truth while also maintaining enough creativity within the boundaries of Tradition so the art form does not stagnate.
Is she working with the help of a spiritual father and some veteran iconographers?
Yes. She has a teacher that has been writing icons for a long time. This teacher liked the idea but didn’t want to risk the black sheep since pitch black represents evil. The other Iconographer is she discussed this with is actually quite famous.
Regarding the Appalachian flair to Byzantine Hymns, well, it is very pleasing to my ears. Enough so that I would consider a move to hear that on a regular basis.
I guess Stefan is mostly accurate but what about Lutheran choral and hymnody?
He would certainly applaud Bach. But his essay is essentially about American issues.
Does Babylon Bee make the cut for comedy/satire entertainment? I’ve always thought of them as the exception to the rule. When people first started linking to their posts, I assumed they were a flash in the pan. But I’ve even had totally secular friends randomly share headlines of theirs just because they thought they were funny.
I appreciate your comments greatly Terry! I don't expect anyone by the way to agree with the entirety of that article. Or with anything I've written.
Looking back, the statements about the Scots-Irish were probably the most underdeveloped aspect of what I wrote and your work of filling in the gaps is valuable. I'm a big fan of numerous Scots-Irish musicians. In addition to what Dr. Vladimir Morosan has written, I know that "Melody" from the Kentucky Harmony shapebook (published in 1816) has also been adapted as an Anaphora/Mercy Of Peace for Orthodox liturgies.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksloCZDdJAw
Abraham Kuyper did indeed make some reverential statements about the arts. However...
Jared Wilson from The Gospel Coalition once stated that "the people who are drawn to Reformed Theology, who really resonate with it, tend to be Systematic-type thinkers, those who appreciate order and categories and so on." I return to the issue of aptitude. Different types of aptitude exist, and Systematic aptitude is uncommon among great artists, while being more common among skilled lawyers, accountants, scientists, business owners and military officers. I would posit "wrong type of aptitude" as an explanation for why the Reformed aren't well-represented among the ranks of great classical music composers, for instance.
There are exceptions to trends and rules, and what I say is meant for reasons of brevity, to be more rough and approximate than exact.
Christ Is Risen!
-Michael
Do you know of a recording of the “Melody” Anaphora setting?
I've looked online but I haven't found any recordings of it, unfortunately.