I haven't seen or read Wicked myself, but Gregory Maguire's novel came out in 1995 and the musical in 2003. Wicked is not the latest example of a villain rehabilitation story -- it's the prototype. It came first. It influenced and paved the way for all the villain rehabilitation stories we have seen on screen over the past two decades. Even if it may not have been directly responsible for all of those, it has definitely had a fundamental role in shaping contemporary popular attitudes towards villainy and evil.
For that reason alone, it may be worth encountering that cultural signal first-hand in one or more of its forms, whether it be the novel, a stage production, or the film.
I saw "Wicked" on tour in San Francisco (!) in 2009. It was great fun, and I didn't get the sense of any of it being any more than "elevated" pop culture - the same messages expressed through high artistic form - this is what the Broadway musical has become. Of course, the messaging has shifted gears and intensified since then.
The thing that interested me the most is that Stephen Schwartz was also the composer of "Godspell" - some of the songs of which were embraced by a large number of "Jesus Movement" folks, even some "conservative" ones. I remember singing "By My Side" as an Offertory hymn in folk Masses. And of course, "Prepare Ye The Way of the Lord" was sung in many different venues: Sunday services as well as Bible studies, camps and other less formal gatherings among less culturally "elevated" young people. Schwartz also wrote "Pippin", another story about an outsider. I think tracing Schwartz's thought and works from a theological angle would make an interesting study.
The thing is, nobody argues that redemption is not possible. Those of us who ascribe to what the New York Times would characterize as bad religion tend to be sympathetic to those who come from broken backgrounds. We acknowledge that sin can lead to a brokenness that is especially hard to overcome. The difference is, we acknowledge that there is sin in the world, and that some choices are better than others.
I'm reminded of Chesterton's fence. Modern people tend to remove fences that they don't see have any purpose. Chesterton, on the other hand, railed against removing any fence until you could outline why the fence had been constructed in the first place. I worry that, if we throw out all the norms of our forebears, because the norms are restricting, we will find that those norms did serve a purpose, but by then it'll be too late.
A good follow up would be looking at Kristen Chenowith. She’s the originator of the role of Glinda on Broadway. Her role as the “affirming” person in the saga is literally who she was during the Obama years (when Wicked’s mainstream popularity rose).
She had a short lived sitcom in 2001 titled “Kristen” about an Oklahoma raised Southern Baptist trying to make it honestly in the Big Apple. She then went on to star in Wicked and television roles on Pushing Daisies and Glee (which had a whole episode around the song ‘Defying Gravity’).
Chenowith’s status an ‘out’ Hollywood Christian and LGBT (no ‘Q’ yet) affirming person made her a practitioner of “good religion.” She even defended the resurrection against Ricky Gervais in Newsweek (I think by saying she believed in make believe). Really interesting follow up.
Yes, I followed her career and her links into hip Hollywood trends and power brokers. An important artist -- but a perfect example of the GOOD RELIGION equation.
Morality with a false excusable view of evil is bad enough but the childish narcissistic theme of defying gravity (which is scientific natural law and theological hubris) is dangerous.
But defying natural law is the whole point in the metaphor. Correct? That's why the song has become an anthem for the new culture, what Kingsnorth calls The Cathedral.
My wife and granddaughter are seeing it this afternoon. I have no interest. I hope there is no occult stuff in it, but they tell me not. I agree with your analysis even sight unseen. I suspect it is just fun. I will know more later in the day.
I haven't seen or read Wicked myself, but Gregory Maguire's novel came out in 1995 and the musical in 2003. Wicked is not the latest example of a villain rehabilitation story -- it's the prototype. It came first. It influenced and paved the way for all the villain rehabilitation stories we have seen on screen over the past two decades. Even if it may not have been directly responsible for all of those, it has definitely had a fundamental role in shaping contemporary popular attitudes towards villainy and evil.
For that reason alone, it may be worth encountering that cultural signal first-hand in one or more of its forms, whether it be the novel, a stage production, or the film.
(The BBC also had a fairly informative interview with Maguire recently: https://www.bbc.com/culture/article/20241122-wicked-author-gregory-maguire-on-the-real-meaning-of-the-story-that-captivated-the-world)
I saw "Wicked" on tour in San Francisco (!) in 2009. It was great fun, and I didn't get the sense of any of it being any more than "elevated" pop culture - the same messages expressed through high artistic form - this is what the Broadway musical has become. Of course, the messaging has shifted gears and intensified since then.
The thing that interested me the most is that Stephen Schwartz was also the composer of "Godspell" - some of the songs of which were embraced by a large number of "Jesus Movement" folks, even some "conservative" ones. I remember singing "By My Side" as an Offertory hymn in folk Masses. And of course, "Prepare Ye The Way of the Lord" was sung in many different venues: Sunday services as well as Bible studies, camps and other less formal gatherings among less culturally "elevated" young people. Schwartz also wrote "Pippin", another story about an outsider. I think tracing Schwartz's thought and works from a theological angle would make an interesting study.
Dana
The thing is, nobody argues that redemption is not possible. Those of us who ascribe to what the New York Times would characterize as bad religion tend to be sympathetic to those who come from broken backgrounds. We acknowledge that sin can lead to a brokenness that is especially hard to overcome. The difference is, we acknowledge that there is sin in the world, and that some choices are better than others.
I'm reminded of Chesterton's fence. Modern people tend to remove fences that they don't see have any purpose. Chesterton, on the other hand, railed against removing any fence until you could outline why the fence had been constructed in the first place. I worry that, if we throw out all the norms of our forebears, because the norms are restricting, we will find that those norms did serve a purpose, but by then it'll be too late.
Props on the phrase “blue-zip-code hymnody.”
A good follow up would be looking at Kristen Chenowith. She’s the originator of the role of Glinda on Broadway. Her role as the “affirming” person in the saga is literally who she was during the Obama years (when Wicked’s mainstream popularity rose).
She had a short lived sitcom in 2001 titled “Kristen” about an Oklahoma raised Southern Baptist trying to make it honestly in the Big Apple. She then went on to star in Wicked and television roles on Pushing Daisies and Glee (which had a whole episode around the song ‘Defying Gravity’).
Chenowith’s status an ‘out’ Hollywood Christian and LGBT (no ‘Q’ yet) affirming person made her a practitioner of “good religion.” She even defended the resurrection against Ricky Gervais in Newsweek (I think by saying she believed in make believe). Really interesting follow up.
Yes, I followed her career and her links into hip Hollywood trends and power brokers. An important artist -- but a perfect example of the GOOD RELIGION equation.
Morality with a false excusable view of evil is bad enough but the childish narcissistic theme of defying gravity (which is scientific natural law and theological hubris) is dangerous.
But defying natural law is the whole point in the metaphor. Correct? That's why the song has become an anthem for the new culture, what Kingsnorth calls The Cathedral.
It's Adam and Eve wanting to be God and decide for themselves what evil is. Gravity and complimentary and opposite sexes is God's natural law.
My wife and granddaughter are seeing it this afternoon. I have no interest. I hope there is no occult stuff in it, but they tell me not. I agree with your analysis even sight unseen. I suspect it is just fun. I will know more later in the day.